RB25DET Information and images

[Matt]

Attached to this post is the collection of info for using an RB25DET with Nistune

Whilst I did have ambitions to make a Type 6 board in the past, the usage of the two options below makes that solution a lot less viable (from board design, doing new firmware and installation difficulty points of view)

(a) R32 RB20DET ECU with external VCT controller (Buddyclub etc) and Type 2 board with modified TPS Idle firmware

HCR32 Idle switch firmware will simulate the TPS switch which RB25 engines do not have. They only have a TPS variable voltage input. We look at the TPS input compare it against 'TPS Trigger voltage' in the constant list table. If the TPS input is below this value then 'TPS idle' is lit and idle enrichment/timing tables are used.

To view this parameter you must have the TPS firmware in the board and then:
File - Open Address File - Browse - 'misc' subfolder then 'HCR32_RB20_256_E_for_RB25.adr'

Update 2 Aug 2010
Do not require wire swap on injectors 4/6 because they use the same driver and connected together inside the ECU

DRIVER 1:
101 (Injector 1)
103 (Injector 3)
110 (Injector 5)

DRIVER 2:
105 (Injector 2)
112 (Injector 4)
114 (Injector 6)

(b) Z32 VG30DET ECU with internal modifications and Type 2 board. Lack of TPS idle switch on this ECU is handled by internal limp value settings. TPS variable input may need to be adjusted on the RB25 to make idle transition smoother (to compensate for using limp values). I've tried to do a similar TPS idle firmware mod but it seems to come unstuck under particular conditions

In this thread I provide the BIN files with RB25DET maps and R33 MAF support

[Zuikkis]

(a) R32 RB20DET ECU with external VCT controller (Buddyclub etc) and Type 2 board with modified TPS Idle firmware

Required to swap injectors 4 and 6 since these are different between RB20 and RB25 looms

As I pointed out in the other topic, swapping injectors 4&6 is not necessary. RB20 ECU only has two injector drivers, 1+3+5 and 2+4+6.. If you look inside the ecu, you'll see that injectors 4 and 6 are the same signal.

Also for Z32 ecu, the injector pins are correct from the start, so the swapping suggested in the pdf shouldn't be done..

[PL]

Interesting about the RB20 injector wires swap. I've been watching a local tuning place using R32 ECU's on RB25's (with RB25 loom) for some time now and after seeing some engine failures on those cylinders they started to wonder. So they did an experiment one day and ran a car up before and after swapping the wires to see if it made any difference. They actually got a substantial power gain when the wires were swapped.

I'll have a look at the wiring myself when I get a chance but the evidence points to a wiring change being required.

PL

[Zuikkis]

Interesting about the RB20 injector wires swap. I've been watching a local tuning place using R32 ECU's on RB25's (with RB25 loom) for some time now and after seeing some engine failures on those cylinders they started to wonder. So they did an experiment one day and ran a car up before and after swapping the wires to see if it made any difference. They actually got a substantial power gain when the wires were swapped.

I'll have a look at the wiring myself when I get a chance but the evidence points to a wiring change being required.

PL

You can check it without removing the ecu, just measure signal wires from the injector connectors.. 1+3+5 and 2+4+6 should beep straight to each other.

http://www.nistune.com/docs/NIStune_Typ ... lation.pdf

Above pdf has a RB20DET ecu image at page 5.. There you can clearly see the two green capacitors, at left lower corner. RB26DETT or Z32 ECU has six of these, as seen in page 8... They are part of the RC circuit, one resistor and capacitor for each injector driver. I know this is a bit lame proof, but easy to check.

[Zuikkis]

I ran out of 2k resistors so I tried 3k3 instead for the Z32 ECU fuel temp sensor.. This didn't work, I got a fault code.

Anyway, at that point I realized that Z32 ecu has DTC filtering in NIStune.. Fuel Temp Sensor fault can be disabled there! No fault code after that. So you don't really need the 2k resistor either, just un-check Fuel Temp Sensor from DTC Filter 4.. Seems to work normally, no fault code even when there is no resistor.

[Matt]

But the fuel temp sensor affects how the car cold start works according to Eric. People who havent fitted the resistor find initial start and running problematic without the resistor

With the 3k3 resistor, what was your fuel temp reported by consult

2K works fine reporting 23 degC ambient temperature

[Matt]

updated document (rev5) included

[Matt]

updated R32 info above. checked the ECU and wires do not need swapping, contrary to previous information floating around on the Nissan ECU tuning forums

[Torque]

I am getting a bit confused now ..

I checked (compared) the 'merged' file vs.my R33GTST maps (.bin) and most values are different in the merged version.
Can someone please explain why these values/maps differ?
Shouldn't they be the same??

Whatever it is in the Z32, it's not my base map.

[Matt]

which maps specifically?

the merged file is Z32 VG30DETT plus maps copied from ECR33 RB25DET for
Fuel map (hi/low)
Timing map (hi/low)
Fuel RPM and TP scalers
Timing RPM and TP scalers
Max/Min TP pulsewidth
MAF = ECR33
K constant = adjusted for ECR33 MAF
High gear coeff = 0 (dont use gear fuel/timing maps)

I cut/paste these from the ECR33 bin file

[Torque]

Hi!

I will send some examples.

From what I recall ignition, fuel, TP limit, injector latency was different.
Will send by EMail.

Cheers,

Andrew

[Matt]

you have an email. I've got screenshots in there showing identical fuel/timing maps and scalers with the merged file and R33 file in two instances of nistune

[Matt]

Z32 ECU Part numbers which can be used with Type 2 board

23710-30Pxx USDM NA
23710-39Pxx
23710-40Pxx JDM TT
23710-31Pxx USDM TT
23710-37Pxx USDM TT
23710-41Pxx JDM TT
23710-47Pxx USDM NA
23710-48Pxx JDM TT

USDM ECUs dont have Nissan part #s listed so JECS part numbers are below:

Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 91 USDM 30P70 (late) " A18-A73 MB7"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 91 USDM 30P75 (late) " A18-A75 MB9"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 91 USDM 41P70 (late) " A18-A77 MC1"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 91 USDM 41P75 (late) " A18-A79 MC3"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 91 USDM 30P60 (late) " A18-A72 MB6"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 91 USDM 41P60 (late) " A18-A76 MC0"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 91 USDM 41P65 (late) " A18-A78 MC2"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 91 USDM 60P65 (late) " A18-A74 MB8"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 30P71 (late) " A18-A92 MD1"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 30P76 (late) " A18-A94 MD3"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 92 USDM 41P70 (late) " A18-A77 MC1"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 92 USDM 41P75 (late) " A18-A79 MC3"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 46P80 (late) " A18-A92 MF7"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 47P80 (late) " A18-A94 MF9"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 30P61 (late) " A18-A91 MD0"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 92 USDM 41P60 (late) " A18-A76 MC0"
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX 92 USDM 41P65 (late) " A18-A78 MC2"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 46P20 (late) " A18-A91 MF6"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 47P20 (late) " A18-A93 MF8"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX 92 USDM 60P66 (late) " A18-A93 MD2"
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P10 N A18-A23 M12
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P11 N A18-A23 M60
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P13 N A18-A23 M75
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P14 N A18-A67 MB0
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P15 N A18-A25 M14
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P16 N A18-A25 M62
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P18 N A18-A25 M73
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P19 N A18-A68 MB1
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 40P60 N C18-A69 MB2
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 40P65 N C18-A70 MB3
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P00 N A18-A22 M11
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P01 N A18-A22 M59
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P05 N A18-A24 M13
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 30P06 N A18-A24 M61
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P10 T A18-A27 M52
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P11 T A18-A27 M68
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P12 T A18-A27 M07
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P13 T A18-A27 MA5
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P15 T A18-A29 M54
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P16 T A18-A29 M70
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P17 T A18-A29 M09
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P18 T A18-A29 MA7
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P00 T A18-A26 M51
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P01 T A18-A26 M67
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P02 T A18-A26 M06
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P03 T A18-A26 MA4
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P05 T A18-A28 M53
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P06 T A18-A28 M69
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P07 T A18-A28 M08
Z32 VG30DET 300ZX (late) 89.5-90 USDM 31P08 T A18-A28 MA6
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) 91 JDM 48P01
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) 92 JDM 41P14
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) 92 JDM 47P10
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) JDM 40P11 M157BDA4
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) JDM 40P00 M157BDM3
Z32 VG30DE 300ZX (late) JDM 40P01 8AB9119J
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P01 M105ADM5
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P00 M105ADM4
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P12 M105ADA5
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P13 M105ADA6
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P04 M18-000-MC8K
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 41P03 M105ADM6
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 48P76
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 51P60 6AK8915J1
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (late) JDM 51P00 A18-C61-Ml4
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) EDM 37P01
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) EDM 37P11
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) JDM 41P01
Z32 VG30DETT 300ZX (Late) JDM 41P13

[Decs]

I know im speaking a dieing language when I say this but...

Is there a way to burn an image file to an eprom that contains the TPS trigger voltage information? Would creating a .bin with the HCR32_RB20_256_E_for_RB25 address file then burning it to a chip work?

[Matt]

no since the ECU code was modified and that is in the ENT file